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Wednesday, December 13th 2023
by btarunrDiscuss (29 Comments)
Intel on Wednesday held a pre-launch round-table with HotHardware, in which it made several performance disclosures of its upcoming Core "Meteor Lake" mobile processor, comparing it with the current U-segment chips based on the 13th Gen Core "Raptor Lake," and competing AMD Ryzen 7040 "Phoenix." In these, the company is claiming that its next-generation iGPU based on the Xe-LPG graphics architecture, armed with 128 EU, is significantly outperforming the Radeon 780M RDNA3 iGPU of the Ryzen 7040, while its CPU is ahead in multi-threaded performance.
In its comparison, the company picked the Core Ultra 7 165H, a middle-of-the-market performance segment part in the 28 W class. This is compared to the Core i7-1370P "Raptor Lake," and the AMD Ryzen 7 7840U. The company also dropped in the fastest Windows-ready Arm chip in the market, the Qualcomm 8cx Gen 3. In the 33 games that the 165H was compared to the 7840U, the Intel iGPU is shown posting performance leads ranging between 3% to 70% over the Radeon 780M, in 23 out of 33 games. In one of the games, the two perform on par with each other. In 9 out of 33 games, the Radeon 780M beats the Intel Xe-LPG by 2% to 18%. The iGPU of the 165H packs 8 Xe cores, or 128 EU (1,024 unified shaders). The Radeon 780M is powered by 12 RDNA3 compute units (768 stream processors).
The Core Ultra 7 165H is a 16-core/22-thread processor, with 6 P-cores, 8 E-cores, and 2 L-cores (low-power island cores). The company put out a selection of multi-threaded CPU performance benchmarks, where it compared the chip to an i7-1370P (6P+8E), and the 7840U (8-core). In its benchmarks, Intel claims that the 165H is an average of 11% faster than the 7840U, and 9% faster than the i7-1370P, which is claimed to be 2% faster than the 7840U. All three chips are claimed to be of a similar power class, catering to the same category of thin-and-light notebooks.
Intel also demonstrated the power management benefits of the 2 low-power island cores in the SoC tile of the "Meteor Lake." The hardware scheduler of the processor is programmed to direct processing load to these cores first, and depending on their performance demand, upgrade them to the E-cores of the Compute tile, and then onward to the P-cores. When idling or with very low performance demand, all background tasks are relegated to the LP island cores, allowing the processor to clock-gate the Compute tile. This results in power savings ranging anywhere between 8% to 35%. Intel considers tasks such as video playback on online streaming services, or web-browsing, as workloads that can be relegated to the LP island cores for such power savings.
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- Tags:
- Core Ultra 7
- Intel
- Intel Xe
- Meteor Lake
- Phoenix
- Raptor Lake
- RDNA3
- Ryzen 7 7840U
- SoC
- Xe-LPG
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I think the smart thing for Intel marketing, would be to mention AMD a lot less. And Just do your work to produce efficient stuff...
Meteor Lake news seems like quite a rollercoaster. Intel's claims here sound impressive. Since tomorrow's "launch" is for laptop CPUs I wonder if there will actually be any hardware in the hands of reviewers and consumers soon or if this will just be the day where OEMs get to advertise specs for laptops they'll release in 2-3 months.
The power numbers look quite good. +10% perf over zen 4 means that zen 5 will likely take back the crown whenever it's available, but I feel like most people expected that already. Good to see the tile architecture paying off in power draw though.
Edit:
Squinting it looks like the fifth bar is microsoft teams and shows no improvement. lol teams.
darakianmeans that zen 5 will likely take back the crown whenever it's available
On time to compete with Intel Arrow Lake. Not sure that will get the crown. + Probably one year for AMD next APU with ZEN 5 CPU part and next generation rDNA iGPU. I'm not sure that AMD will keep APU crown.
TumbleGeorgeOn time to compete with Intel Arrow Lake. Not sure that will get the crown. + Probably one year for AMD next APU with ZEN 5 CPU part and next generation rDNA iGPU. I'm not sure that AMD will keep APU crown.
Depends. If zen 5 follows zen 4 then it'll be available in mid 2024 where arrow lake is expected late 2024. I'm super excited to see where intel takes the tile architecture but amd has also shown that they're pushing packaging forward with mi300 as well. Unclear when those advancements come to the consumer lines but I'm excited to see both companies firing on all cylinders.
darakianDepends. If zen 5 follows zen 4 then it'll be available in mid 2024 where arrow lake is expected late 2024. I'm super excited to see where intel takes the tile architecture but amd has also shown that they're pushing packaging forward with mi300 as well. Unclear when those advancements come to the consumer lines but I'm excited to see both companies firing on all cylinders.
There is no way they will launch ZEN 5, in the middle of the year, except for a paper launch. Who would buy a new and expensive desktop computer when they're going to spend money on a beach vacation?
All three chips are claimed to be of a similar power class, catering to the same category of thin-and-light notebooks.
A quick check on Notebookcheck.com
The 1370p is like consuming 10W more than the 7840U consistently in all core applications.
It translate to 20% more power consumption.
It is not the same at all.
CrackongA quick check on Notebookcheck.com
The 1370p is like consuming 10W more than the 7840U consistently in all core applications.
It translate to 20% more power consumption.It is not the same at all.
1370p is 60W chip, 7840u is 28w. This is 115% more power
Is it really going to look 10% better in real life devices?
Intel needs this aggressive marketing because that's all they have for the next year.
TumbleGeorgeOn time to compete with Intel Arrow Lake. Not sure that will get the crown. + Probably one year for AMD next APU with ZEN 5 CPU part and next generation rDNA iGPU. I'm not sure that AMD will keep APU crown.
Zen 5 launches earlier than Arrow Lake. So AMD will have the edge for about 6 months assuming Arrow Lake does not get delayed or fast tracked.
usiname1370p is 60W chip, 7840u is 28w. This is 115% more power
According to Intel ark.
1370p has a TDP of 28W, but has a 'Turbo power' of 64W.
In notebookcheck's review it usually hovers around 60W all-core
S.T.A.R.S.
After that ridiculous "snake oil" BS from Intel, I find it pretty hard to trust anything their marketing is saying.
Sure intel whatever you say Intel.....
14 Cores vs 8 Cores and only 11% faster in multi threaded apps? :roll: oh dear!
AMD too late . Intel make better APU now
I doubt that Intel's H and P line models have a TDP and consumption equivalent to the 7840u, and without Dying light on the graph, would Intel be 5% faster or a bit less...
for those who don't know, 28w on intel is equivalent to almost 70-80w, And to think this will go up against Zen5.:p
Maybe it will be a bit faster, but I've already bought a laptop with 7540U with a nice Black Friday discount. I'm very happy with it.
I’m waiting to hear about single thread performance and IPC. The IPC might be worse vs Raptor Lake.
Edit: Intel confirms single threaded performance is lower vs Raptor Lake.
So much for ‘serious’ IPC increase on the P cores.
darakianzen 5 will likely take back the crown whenever it's available,
TomorrowZen 5 launches earlier than Arrow Lake. So AMD will have the edge for about 6 months assuming Arrow Lake does not get delayed or fast tracked.
One thing to remember is that this AMD generally releases Desktop Parts first, in addition they already announced the 8040 series for mobile too.
They generally announce their mobile parts on CES, so Zen 5 APUs at earliest will probably be in CES 2025(i.e. January 2025).
This is important as Meteor Lake doesn't compete with any random CPU SKU but really just the mobile variants.
So it will really depend on how well, Meteor Lake does against Phoenix/Hawk Point(which is a Phoenix refresh) and if they can deliver Arrow Lake on time to compete against Zen 5 APUs.
Good for Intel, I guess. They claim they've finally managed to catch up and if that means AMD spends more effort on their own IGPs, we all win. Sadly, Arc A380 performance looked good on paper when it was announced by Intel but the real world cards were a bit of a driver sh*t-show, and that's effectively the GPU this IGP is - same architecture, same configuration, same drivers.
Intel's driver team has been improving at a decent pace since the Arc A750 and A770 launches last year but they are still very much a "tinkerer's experiment" and nowhere near as good, reliable, or trouble-free as AMD or Nvidia options. If you're lucky, you might get it working with comparable performance to the competition in DX12 titles, but the overwhelming majority of titles you are likely to be running on a thin-and-light ultraportable laptop with integrated graphics are going to be DX11 or older. You will not find a single review outlet on the web recommend ARC graphics cards to anyone not willing to spend a lot of time troubleshooting, editing .ini files, replacing .dlls, and being okay with waiting a few weeks or months for new games to run without major issues.
persondbOne thing to remember is that this AMD generally releases Desktop Parts first, in addition they already announced the 8040 series for mobile too.They generally announce their mobile parts on CES, so Zen 5 APUs at earliest will probably be in CES 2025(i.e. January 2025).
This is important as Meteor Lake doesn't compete with any random CPU SKU but really just the mobile variants.
So it will really depend on how well, Meteor Lake does against Phoenix/Hawk Point(which is a Phoenix refresh) and if they can deliver Arrow Lake on time to compete against Zen 5 APUs.
Strix Point mobile with 16CU's and 12 cores (monolithic) based on Zen 5 and RDNA 3.5 launches in Q3 2024, supposedly. Strix Halo with 40CU's and lower end Escher and Kraken variants release in 2025.
A GPU with 33% more shaders but only 11% higher performance on average is kinda meh.
Oh surprise, more we are awesome Intel slides.
usiname1370p is 60W chip, 7840u is 28w. This is 115% more power
If they wanted to compare strictly on power usage they should have compared to the 7945HX3D which is a 55-watt part.
Putting that up against Meteor Lake would have been like watching a Jedi fight a quadriplegic.
BeermotorPutting that up against Meteor Lake would have been like watching a Jedi fight a quadriplegic.
Nearly spit out my coffee loling at that one.
